Can There Be Humans Without a Soul?

The question is: Would a scientifically Cloned human who was NOT “incubated” or grown inside a human mother for 9 months….would it have any Soul?

Suppose a Mother is going to have twins. They will be born and they will be healthy. Will each twin have a Soul?  Most everyone will also say “Yes!” Of course. But now, just suppose—

A scientist Clones a human being from conception in a Petri dish and somehow feeds and “grows” it outside a Mother until  “regular 9-month birth time” and then keeps feeding it and letting some parents adopt it.  A healthy, functioning, CLONE.  It can crawl, later walk, learn to talk and keep on developing as a natural kid would. Question: but does this “human” have a Soul??  While most people would say the husband & wife “made a  baby”, we *don’t* usually say that the parents “put” the Soul into the baby.

So, if God does it for a Natural baby (puts a Soul into the body), does a Scientist put a Soul into a lab-created Clone? I think people would say “NO!”.  How would they? From where? 

—then, now we have a Human without  a Soul, and when it dies, there is nothing to go to Heaven, or Hell, or even any sort of near-death or after-death anything!!

It gets weirder and opens a big can of worms.  Religiously, if one has no soul, is it possible to be “tempted”? It would seem not. If no soul, then WHAT is being tempted?  Another question: If your Soul hasn’t sinned (because you dont have one), will the Clone escape any Judgement Day?  There is still more—

When “natural” people have a near-death experience, they often report they experienced a rapid Life-review of their earthly Life. Would this happen if a being had no Soul? If there is no soul to go on to a Hell, or Heaven, or some other “plane”, then what’s the point? Would anything–other than–a Soul go to a Heaven or a Hell?  What?

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Spiritual Advancement

You’ve probably heard people mention “Spiritual Evolution”. But think about this:

You can go back to the 80’s and read metaphysical or occult or spiritual books. You can go back to the 40’s, and the 20’s. But go back somewhat further and something interesting happens—

In 1888, Helena Petrovna Blavatsky wrote her 2 vol. “The Secret Doctrine.” Suddenly, we’ve info about different “planes” of spiritual existence, But where did Blavatsky get this idea? And she talks about older spiritual “Races”…i.e…the Lemurians, the Atlanteans, etc…but again, where did Blavatsky get this idea and how does she know its true?

90% of everything you might read today about spiritual “evolution” goes back to Theosophy. But there is more—

The Seccret Doctrine came out in 1888. Darwin wrote The Origen of Species in 1859, twenty-nine years earlier. And NOBODY ASKS “what was written about Spirituality BEFORE Theosophy”? Answer: Spiritualism. In 1850, “the Poukeepsie Seer” Andrew Jackson Davis wrote “The Great Harmonia”. There is an Afterlife, and continuing on in some spirit world. There is no reincarnation, or different spiritual races “evolving” into a new one.

This was 9 years before before Darwin would write about evolution.

Spiritualism was wildly popular in America, especially from 1850-1880. By 1885, Davis would have been married 3 times and his influence soon faded.

Then the Secret Doctrine books would come in 1888. But Spiritualism was not dead. It would become popular in England. Also, here in America, in 1891, the Ouija Board would be invented. But today, nobody bothers to look back in history to see how or when things started. So, maybe there isnt really any “evolution” (other than being in some spiritual body after death” but there is “continuing” in an Afterlife and learning more.

Does a Cloned human being have a Soul?

The question is: Would a Cloned human who was NOT “incubated” or grown inside a human mother for 9 months, have any Soul?

Suppose a Mother is going to have twins. They will be born and they will be healthy. Will each twin have a Soul?  Most everyone will also say “Yes!”   But now, just suppose—

A scientist Clones a human being from conception in a Petri dish and somehow feeds and “grows” it outside a Mother until  “regular 9-month birth time” and then keeps feeding it and letting some parents adopt it.  A healthy, functioning, CLONE.  It can crawl, later walk, learn to talk and keep on developing as a natural kid would. Question: but does this “human” have a Soul??  While most people would say the husband & wife “made a  baby”, we *don’t* usually say that the parents “put” the Soul into the baby.

So, if God does it for a Natural baby (puts a Soul into the body), does a Scientist put a Soul into a lab-created Clone? I think people would say “NO!”.  How would they? From where? 

—then, now we have a Human without  a Soul, and when it dies, there is nothing to go to Heaven, or Hell, or even any sort of near-death or after-death anything!!

It gets weirder and opens a big can of worms.  Religiously, if one has no soul, is it possible to be “tempted”? It would seem not. If no soul, then WHAT is being tempted?  Another question: If your Soul hasn’t sinned (because you dont have one), will the Clone escape any Judgement Day?  There is still more—

When “natural” people have a near-death experience, they often report they experienced a rapid Life-review of their earthly Life. Would this happen if a being had no Soul? If there is no soul to go on to a Hell, or Heaven, or some other “plane”, then what’s the point? Would anything–other than–a Soul go to a Heaven or a Hell?  What?

Spiritual Advancement

I like to read about Religions, Psychic development, Spirituality, etc.

When you ask someone else who is “into” those sorts of things: “Why are we here? What is our purpose?”—-you might be told: “to advance and develop, spiritually.”

This may sound good, but if you pause and think about it for a minute, that tells you almost nothing at all. So let’s go deeper and ask:

1. Exactly what—is “more spiritual”?
2. Whatever it is, it should be recognizable, so you could say you want to be more like *that*, and describe what that is.
3. How can you tell when one person is “farther along the Path” than someone who is a newbie?
4. Is your Teacher or mentor more Spiritual than you? How? Exactly what makes him or her that way?
5. Even if they are more advanced, does this mean in any way that they have further “evolved”? Far too many people take “spiritual evolution” to be some automatic given, as if all you have to do is simply be interested at all or just read 1 or 2 books and evolution is automatic….but if you believe in spiritual evolution, ask yourself: “evolving” towards …What?? How? And how would you know that it’s any “higher”? No one really seems to be able to say. So again, what is Spiritual development? How does more of it look different from less of it and how do you know you are doing it? People work out in a Gym to get physically stronger. How can you exercise in order to advance or get stronger spiritually? Comments always welcome.

Where did your Soul come from?

Religion. The Occult. Spirituality. And—your Soul.

So! You were born. You are alive, and you have a Soul. If you believe you have a Soul, you probably also believe it will go…..somewhere……after death.   But where it might go is not my question.

Instead, I want to know (and no one is asking about this)—WHERE was it?–before– you were born?  Where did it come from? Where was your Soul before itBut was in your baby body?   Not–who made it, but rather, where was it?  It had to come from somewhere…where? If God made it, fine. But before your Soul went into your current physical body, where was it waiting?

JUDGEMENT DAY. Questions you never asked.

“Someday, you’re gonna have to answer for that.”

You’ve probably heard that at some point in your Life. Or, “we will all have to give an account”—-But have you ever asked:

1. What if there is some Afterlife, but not any “life-review” or punishment based on what we did in our lives?
2. Suppose there is life after death but not a Hell? What if there isn’t terrible pain and misery but not ecstatic bliss, either?  What might it be like then?

It gets me curious, when I think about it. What if there is an Afterlife, but not like what we have been taught or heard about?

You may have heard that in Christianity the greatest commandment is to Love God with all thy heart, all thy mind, etc……and that the second greatest commandment is to love thy neighbor as thyself. And so, just picture this:

You’ve died and you are being “weighed in the balance” or, its judgement day and you are being evaluated. And you yourself, in your own defense, say:  But I loved my neighbor as myself. I gave money to a beggar with a cardboard sign. I made sandwiches at the soup kitchen. I jogged and got a ribbon for “raising awareness”. I gave furniture to the Salvation Army.    All of which is nice, but——

What if you were then told:, Yes, those were good, but many of them you did for the recognition you got from other people knowing you did it—-and—-while you did those things, you almost completely ignored the BIGGEST commandment of all:

You never really sought God, or loved him. Certainly nowhere near “with all you Heart, all your Mind, etc”.   Not even close.  On the other hand I must ask: Can it even be done? To put God 1st. Consistently. Who has time? Or maybe thats the problem. It doesnt mean we shouldn’t try. But most of us dont want any one thing, or person, or activity to crowd-out too many other enjoyable things in our Life. A variety of interests and experiences is good, and yet loving God is the greatest commandment. Food for thought.

There must be thousands, millions of people like that. Who worry about “being of service and making a difference” while they practically leave out God. And they act as if they are completely unaware of this. Or maybe they don’t care. They spent sooooo much time on the 2nd commandment (and mostly for recognition) that they 95% ignored the first and greatest commandment.  Let that sink in.

Some Questions on Religion and History

Some questions on Religion and History:

Were the Pyramids built before, or after, “Noah’s Flood”?  How do you know?

Adam was said to be the first man. But why wasn’t much more written about his death? He got old, lived so many years and he died. I would think that this would have been a much lamented and talked about event.  Front Page News!  National mourning. But no, pretty-much just a: he was so many years old and he died.   That’s it!??  But it seems to be all we’re told.

This was the first man. How did he die?  What knowledge did he pass on to others? How did the people or the public react on hearing of his death?

The Hindu’s believe in Reincarnation. How did this belief ever become accepted?

Many people believe they have a soul and that when your physical body dies, your soul lives on, but where was your Soul before you were born? No one talks about this.

Who were the first Babylonians?

”””and thoughts of man’s heart were evil continually and it GRIEVED God that he  made man”. How interesting. To me, it sounds as if God did NOT realize things would be this way in advance. Why would God deliberately do something that would cause himself grief or regret?  What if God has the power to do these things but does NOT know the future outcome at the time he does it? I get that impression here with this example, but most people today do not want to believe this.

How did God or “the Gods” know what a female is?  Christianity refers to God the Father (masculine)

God the Son (masculine) and….the Holy Spirit. Is the Holy Spirit feminine? No? Didn’t Jesus refer to the Holy Spirit as “the Comforter” and say “He” will guide you into all truth? But then if God, and the Son and the Holy Spirit are all “he’s”, then how did they know what a female was/is when Eve was created?

Andy Stanley & people who left Church

Billy Graham has passed away.
I suspect that Andy Stanley will now be the one who “directs society” rightly or wrongly, about Christianity.
He has recently preached a series of sermons on why people have likely rejected or turned away from Christianity and/or God, but that those versions or beliefs about God, were inaccurate and asks: who told you that? (I wish I could remember the name of this series or how it was worded/titled. Gods of the NO Testament?? Not sure.) But I couldn’t help thinking that people turned away from those things because they heard them in Church, for years, and their lives turned out differently from what they heard. It’s the churches who very likely who told them. Most of the public hasn’t gone to Seminary.

It seems to me as if Andy Stanley is laying groundwork on TV to criticize what has “gone before” in churches and getting ready for some sort of “re-set” as to what the public will be taught. People should be watchful to see where all this goes.
I’ve also heard that Andy has had arguments or disagreements with his dad, Charles Stanley and I think Andy himself has admitted that he likes to read DE-conversion stories (about people who have left the faith). I cant help wondering if sometime in the next few years that he himself may decide he no longer believes anymore. That may not happen. Whether it does or doesn’t is a separate matter.

The main thing with him right now looks to me to be about him trying to convince people that the Christianity folks have left over the last 30 or 40 years wasn’t the “Real” Christianity, and I’m curious to see how he will “define” it all and how he might make it appealing today to get people back into Church, as the numbers are significantly down.

.The sad part is too many people don’t read their New Testaments enough to call him on some of his teachings and challenge or refute him.
Example: will he say that Homosexuality is wrong, as it says, strongly, in the last half of ROMANS, Chapter 1 ?
Example 2: does he preach “Once saved, always saved?”, that you can’t lose your salvation? I believe that is a false doctrine, whoever teaches it. It ignores other clear teaching about “Apostasy”, and falling away, and falling-from-grace, and backsliding.
Where is any preacher on TV on the Daystar television network who will say Homosexuality is a sin? Either they wont, or they will poo-poo it with: welllll, it is, but then so is lying, stealing, lust, etc. That may be true, but you can tell they are really letting it slide. Or, they’ll simply accuse you of “legalism” which is really just a tactic to get you to shut up.  These days church attendance is down in the USA. I wonder what tactics will be used to get the public to become Christians and get them back into church? Joel Osteen is wrong. Rock music and blue jeans has been tried. Hyper-Grace and over-emphasizing “love” has been tried. Beware of falsehoods. Where will it go from here?

What is Spirituality?

What is Spirituality?

What do you feel it is?  Why?

step 1.  DEFINE EVERYTHING!
WHAT IS –being on “the Path”? The path to what? and why that?
What IS –‘Enlightenment”?
What is the 1st sign of “Awakening”? And why do you feel that is the first sign?
How is a “more spiritual” person different from a less spiritual one? And don’t hide behind “I don’t want to judge anyone”.
What does ANYONE even mean by “Spirituality” anyway? To say “spiritual, but not religious” still tells anyone asking nearly nothing. And being vague is not being profound. Or any sign of “wisdom”.

Get specific! What does the guru mean by it? What do *you* mean by it? and why that?

…..and….if all of the above is too “hard core” or “exhausting” for you, then you are either “faking it” or still haven’t “evolved” enough.
What is Spirituality?—“spirituality is just a too-politically-correct word for wimps who wont take a stand on anything and don’t know what the hell they believe. But they think it sounds “cool” anyway”. What do you believe? Why does it makes sense to you?
NO APOLOGIES for defining things!

And then there is spiritual “development”. What is that? How would you know you have developed and are “further along the Path” than you were before?

Name 3 bad spiritual paths. What makes the path you are following now, better?
Do you have ANY idea -at all- of 4 or 5 of the popular beliefs/paths that people have followed as “alternative spirituality” over the last 150 years? Name them. Who was the founder? What did they teach? Again, how is what you are doing now, better?
Do you believe there are “paths” that are a waste of time (and don’t just pick on Christianity. Dare to critique another “alternative spirituality belief-system”).
I really want to know. And no, I’m not an Atheist or Materialist.

NEW questions about Near-death experiences

Near-death experiences. You’ve heard the story:

“The doctors said I was dead. I was out of my body and could see and hear them working on me. Then I whoooosshhed through this “tunnel” and realized I was dead. I saw a “playback” of my Life. Then, I was in the presence of this bright white light (some report a bluish-white light) and I felt this intense, incredible love coming from the light.”

Then, people are either told they must come back, or, given a choice to come back or not. Then, they wake back up, here on earth, alive. And they often report they have no fear of death. Most of them. Some people have had terrifying experiences and are very glad to have “a second chance”.

But that isn’t what I want to talk about. It’s what’s left out, and not talked about, that I find curious:

Think about it. In all these many testimonies (mostly positive), when you think about it, it strikes me as very odd, that seemingly NO ONE, ever, that we’ve read or heard about, has ever bothered to ask “the loving white light”:  (and I say this as someone who is not a member of any church):

1. “ARE YOU, Jesus Christ?  If not, who are you?
2. Tell me, who is Jesus Christ? Do YOU love Jesus?
3. Why can’t I see your face?
4. Is this Heaven?  Where are we now?
5. Loving feelings or not, if I don’t go back, and do come with you, will I be in Hell? Would you accompany me into Heaven?
6. White Light—what is your Name?  Are you Satan? Lucifer? Who?

And NOBODY asks. Isn’t that strange? Hundreds of testimonies, and not one person bothers to ask.  People just believe whatever they’re told by some mysterious light that radiates “love”,  we have have no idea WHO we’re talking to, WHERE we are, where the light would take us if we stayed, or who the Light is, or what the light thinks about Jesus.  Feelings of love or not, that white light sounds pretty-darn vague. Why? Think about all this. Share this post with others.

Service is over-rated.

Service, is overrated! Serving humanity. “A life of service.”

” Giving Back to the Community. ”

So that we can “Make a difference”.

And feel “empowered”.

Funny how no one ever spells out exactly what “the Community” ever already did for them, personally, so that they would ever feel any need to “give back” in the first place!

Its not that doing good things for others is bad, I’m not saying that. But its overrated. Far too many people do it so they can tell others that they did. They want the recognition.

To show they “cared”. And “made a difference”. Now, they get to feel “empowered.” And they “gave back to the Community” more than you did. It goes too far. And “being of service” far too often becomes a matter of putting burdens and a sense of obligation and Duty onto others –and ourselves!

Far too many people “give back” so that they can wear the pin or ribbon they got for “serving” to work the next day, so folks will ask them what that is, and maybe then they can 1-upmanship you and say how they “cared” enough to “make a difference” and now they “feel empowered” .

How much Volunteerism would really get done if you couldn’t tell anyone that you did it?

And, just suppose, what if loving  and seeking God counted more than how many sandwiches you made at the Soup kitchen, or how many fundraisers you went to, or marathons you ran in?  What if understanding spiritual laws and developing yourself spiritually counts more in the afterlife than your last fundraiser?

In the Bible, Jesus says in Matthew, chapter 22, verse 37 that the greatest commandment is that “you shall love the Lord your God with all of your heart, all of your soul and all of your mind.” In the very next verse,  verse 38, he adds that “This is the first and great commandment.”  After that, if you continue reading further, he goes on to say that the second  great commandment is “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

In my opinion, the problem today is that too many people are trying to do the 2nd commandment and ignoring the 1st.

While Charity and doing good works are commendable, i feel that “Making a Difference” is todays politically-correct all-the-rage FAD. Everyone-and-their-dog wants to “make a difference” –and while kindness is good,  “service” and  “giving back” can become a burden that robs you of  pleasure and Joy!

Don’t let it. Too much service can drain you emotionally. Some, is good. But watch out– it can become  “Duty gone wild”. And people really can get “compassion fatigue”. No matter how much you do, you can’t save the world.  It’s important to “feel alive!” , to have some Zest in life and to FEEL like smiling! Activists burn out. So do group organizers. Service becomes their “religion” or a 1-upmanship game with them to show everyone how much the “cared”.  But many of them don’t look happy. They may tell themselves they are doing the right thing, but when they are away from “the Cause”, how enthusiastic (about Life-in-general) are they? How often do they laugh? Very likely, not enough. I say: being a helpful coworker, yes. Being a sincere & reliable friend, yes. But being a service-fanatic or community-activist so you can “look good” around others, naaah.  What if you were stranded alone on a large island and couldn’t do anything for someone else?  Would that make your Life meaningless?

I don’t always agree with Alan Watts, especially when he talks (in other videos) about “the Self”. Bleeaugh!  But on some other things, I think he makes good points. But we all must decide for ourselves.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21RwqnB8GrE

Some thoughts on Spiritualism & Spirituality

I had fun researching and reading about what I’ll call “History of Alternative Spirituality/Occult.

Here’s some thoughts on Spiritualism.  The “Big-Daddy” of Modern Spiritualism would be, in my opinion, Andrew Jackson Davis. He wrote: The Principles of Nature (1847) and The Great Harmonia (1850). He died in January of 1910.

In 1875,  we got Helena Petrovna Blavatsky and the founding of Theosophy (the Theosophical Society). This was less Spiritualistic and more Occult than Spiritualism. By 1885, Andrew Jackson Davis would have been married 3 times and had all of them end. His popularity very likely diminished after that. In 1888, Blavatsky would write The Secret Doctrine.  A massive 2 vol. set that few would read completely. She had already written another 2 vol. set earlier called: Isis Unveiled (in 1877 ?).

Even though Davis’s popularity faded, many people were still interested in Spiritualism. Why rely on Davis? People wanted to communicate with the dead on their own. Then we got “the Ouija Board” (in 1891?)

But Science and Materialism were marching on, and we also had Robert G. Ingersoll “The Great Agnostic’ and his writings from about 1872 to 1899. In 1902, after Davis’s 3 marriages, Frank Podmore would write “Modern Spiritualism”. I believe this was a critque.  Then, 1914-1918, we had World War 1.

By the 1920’s, there were all sorts of beliefs one could get into: Spiritualism, Theosophy, “The Mind-Cure Movement” (as William James called it), Psychology, Christianity, Mysticism and more. Spiritualsim would still be popular in England. Arthur Conan Doyle would turn to Spiritualism, and Arthur Finlay would write the book “On the Edge of the Etheric”. Then, in America, we would have the Great Depression and also World War 2 and alot of people were likely too busy for alot of reading.

That’s my opinion, from reading and researching. I wasn’t there but I think that’s close to how things went.  If you want still more info, a good book on this kind of stuff is “Occult America” by Mitch Horowitz. Amazon.com should carry it.